In the House... Debates in the House of Commons

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): My right hon. Friend will know about the significant impact of the disease in north Yorkshire, especially the moorland areas. I pay tribute to the former ministerial team, the officials and the vets, especially for what happened in the hefted areas of the moorland. The BBC, the trading standards people and the national parks people all played an important part in disseminating information. In the light of the lessons learned about biosecurity measures, as outlined in the report, what training will be provided for people in agriculture and vets and what measures will be taken to improve information dissemination in remote areas in future?

Margaret Beckett: My hon. Friend makes an important point and, indeed, Dr. Anderson reports how, in several areas, the best and most effective source of information was the local radio, with regular bulletins and so on. Dr. Anderson is clear that that is one of the lessons that we can all learn. He also identifies the need for an overall communications strategy, not least about subjects such as biosecurity and ensuring better information, training and practice on farms to minimise some of the difficulties that were experienced in the outbreak.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): Many seaside communities such as Scarborough and Whitby have a persistent problem in relation not only to tenants, but landlords who fail to police and monitor their tenants' activities. My local council and local community would want this measure to be placed on the statute book to give them an extra deterrent to ensure that such behaviour is dealt with.

Mr. Field: I do agree. Given that our seaside towns usually have a higher proportion of elderly people than elsewhere, it is interesting that my hon. Friend chooses not to use the scare tactic that we have to protect pensioners from the measure when, of course, we want to protect them from antisocial behaviour. He probably knows that a clause in the original Bill dealt directly with landlords. Sadly, it had to be withdrawn because it clashed with human rights legislation that the House passed.

The good news is that the Government are considering measures for the next Session aimed specifically at bad landlords, in particular those who make a cool killing on milking housing benefit. Those people pay not the slightest attention to how they contribute to the collapse of working-class areas by accommodating such families. None of us would want to live next door to those families, so we should not inflict them on our constituents.

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Lawrie Quinn: The hon. Gentleman mentioned the migration problem when people are moved from one neighbourhood to another. Does he realise that the movement of people from one seaside resort to another is now being encouraged by absentee landlords who are trying to milk the system? What answer does he have for my constituents who have asked me to come here today and support the Bill? What does he think I should tell them?

Mr. Webb: The hon. Gentleman makes a perfectly fair point. As he has discovered from earlier interventions, the parts of the Bill that deal with landlords have been removed, so nothing in the Bill deals with the point that he makes. However, a document from the former Department of Transport, Local Government and the Regions on tackling antisocial tenants makes proposals that would help deal with landlords who do not take their responsibilities seriously.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): I am sure that my hon. Friend considered the contribution from the very inland hon. Member for Sutton Coldfield (Mr. Mitchell) to be important and timely, but is he aware that my constituents want to know what the Government and the European Union are thinking of doing in order to cultivate and train future fishermen, and to bring about the circumstances which we hope will result from reform of the fisheries policy?

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mr. Elliot Morley): The European Union, through structural funds, recognises that it is legitimate for member states to use funds to support a range of training initiatives. We are doing that in the United Kingdom, for example by providing free safety training for all fishermen. I am glad to announce that, tomorrow, at the fisheries exhibition in Glasgow, I will launch a new apprenticeship scheme designed to provide training for new entrants to the fishing industry. We believe that, despite the problems of management, the industry has a good long-term future. We need to consider how to attract crew and ensure that people have a professional, safe and long-term future in what could be a very good industry for this country.

10.20 am

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Burton (Mrs. Dean) on securing this important debate. It is a pleasure to follow a fellow chartered civil engineer. We both know the importance of foundations and structures. In this debate, it is important to recognise the linkages between each facet of the industry.

I want to concentrate on the importance of the seaside, but I will not rehearse the weather forecasts that we have heard from such delightful places as Skegness, Margate, South Thanet, Great Yarmouth -

Chris Ruane : And Rhyl.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby) And Rhyl. The best place, and the place where the seaside industry was founded, is Scarborough. On behalf of my community, I thank my right hon. Friend the Minister for the tremendous work he did in laying key foundations to help the regeneration of the seaside while he was at the Department of Trade and Industry and the former Department of the Environment, Transport and the Regions. That important work led to my community being established as an objective 2 area.

An engineer's view of what confronts us would be simple. The Government are taking a long time to determine their response to the Budd report and, therefore, we face a blight on the industry at every level. I reiterate my previous invitations to the Minister to come to the front at Scarborough and do what Sir Alan Budd was not prepared to do: meet the many families who run businesses there. They cannot invest in their businesses because they are unsure of their direction.

The Budd report offers opportunities as well as challenges for the seaside community. The direction of the regeneration for which the Minister was responsible in seaside communities such as Scarborough and Whitby, links to the possibilities for developing a casino-like culture in places such as Scarborough. I have a vision, which many of my constituents share, of turning Scarborough perhaps not into the Las Vegas of the north, but something like the Monte Carlo of the north. I notice that my neighbour, the hon. Member for Ryedale (Mr. Greenway), knows exactly what I mean. The beauty of the area is very similar to that of Monte Carlo. He represents the good people of Filey, so he will know that a casino in Scarborough, as well as suitable hotel development, could bring about the Minister's vision.

My simple message to the Minister from the many people who work in the seaside community in Scarborough is that he will be throwing the baby out with the bathwater by taking up the proposals on seaside gambling in the Budd report. The North sea is very grey and cold even at the best times of the year. Prosperity could be increased for many people in my community and I am here to try to bring that about. If that does not happen, my community will be blighted and things will be bleak.

At the earliest opportunity - today would be great - will the Minister please say that he is prepared to put to one side the proposals relating to the seaside community and gambling, which is the only way to go until we have some effective research? We must end the blight and bring about prosperity for the seaside, especially for my constituents in Scarborough and Whitby.

10.25 am

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): May I welcome in particular the section in the recommendations on upland areas such as those in my constituency? Each upland area is unique and there is great expertise--I think in particular of the North Yorkshire moors national park--in stewardship schemes and the enhancement of the local environment, built up over the years within the national parks. Does my right hon. Friend envisage a role for the expertise of the national parks in helping the recommendations to come to fruition and to aid my constituents in those areas?

Margaret Beckett: My hon. Friend makes an important and powerful point. He is right about the expertise and experience. We hope to draw on as much of that as possible, across the board, when we make the Government's proposals to take forward the strategy identified by the commission. As I said, the commission is adamant that there is no one-size-fits-all solution. My hon. Friend is right about that. It is clear that there will be different opportunities and different problems for farmers in different circumstances and in different parts of the country. That is why it is so important for people to address the problems that they actually face, rather than a generic set of problems that are said to beset all farmers.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): I am sure that the House would want to wish the Minister well with his negotiations in Brussels next week, but will he confirm that his approach to those negotiations will be based on sound science, sustainability, especially for areas such as the North sea, and a long-term approach that will deliver for fishing communities, such as Scarborough and Whitby?

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mr. Elliot Morley): I can certainly confirm that, and I know that my hon. Friend is very concerned about the fishing fleets in Scarborough and Whitby, but the fact is that if we do not follow the science, even though that, on occasion, might mean taking very difficult and tough decisions, there will be no fishing industry. It is fair to say that, in this round of negotiations, the Commission's position on a range of stocks goes beyond the science and does not appear to have sound scientific justification. In those circumstances, I will most certainly challenge its position.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): While we are talking about families enjoying the traditional seaside experience, does my hon. Friend agree that many of the businesses that we see along our seafronts, as at Scarborough, have been put together by families? They understand what families want. My hon. Friend referred earlier to blue skies, but sadly, we do not get permanently blue skies, even in places like Scarborough and Whitby. Families can go to arcades and have a good experience at the seaside. That is probably what is at risk as a consequence of the Budd report.

Dr. Ladyman : My hon. Friend is right. In Scarborough and Whitby the skies usually are blue, although not quite so often as they are in Ramsgate, Margate and Broadstairs--but he has made an important point. Arcades provide an all-weather facility for people on their holidays. They are harmless fun and no more than that. It is nonsense to take cranes out of the seaside arcade or to class those small pusher machines, the so-called "penny fall" machines, and the wheel-them-in machines, as gambling that will have a corrupting influence on our youth.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): I welcome my right hon. Friend to her new job. I was delighted by the establishment of the Department, which is the way forward for the rural parts of my constituency. My right hon. Friend knows that there was a recent outbreak of the disease in Westerdale in the North York moors national park and that the rural economy, especially tourism, in Castleton and Danby has been devastated over many months. I wholeheartedly support the remarks of the right hon. Member for Skipton and Ripon (Mr. Curry).
When the regional development agency and others put together the recovery plan, especially for Yorkshire, will my right hon. Friend ensure that the national parks are included in its construction? Will she also make sure that small rural business, such as those in Castleton and Danby, are not forgotten? Sometimes their remoteness makes them believe that they are out of touch with developments. It is essential that they are not excluded and forgotten.

Margaret Beckett: I thank my hon. Friend for his remarks. Of course we shall take account of the problems that arise in the national parks, and involve them. I do not believe that any hon. Member is under an illusion about the difficulties that small, rural businesses have experienced. Although some of the communities to which he referred are small, they are often well known and popular with a much wider group in the community. I therefore assure him and his constituents that there is no question of overlooking their anxieties, fears and problems. The Government will endeavour to tackle them as fully as possible. I know that he shares the view, which the Government have repeatedly expressed, that we can get on with the task better when we bring the outbreak of the disease to an end.

Mr. Lawrie Quinn (Scarborough and Whitby): I also welcome my right hon. Friend to his post. Following a recent visit to my constituency, he knows the importance of tourism to the rural economy. Will he find time for a debate on the impact of the foot and mouth crisis on the rural economy, particularly tourism, as many people are wondering whether they will survive this season? The Government need to address the future of our rural economies, especially the problems in the tourism industry.

Mr. Cook: I fully understand that foot and mouth has had an impact not only on the agriculture industry, but on the wider rural economy, especially tourism and the leisure industry. Those matters are entirely relevant to the statement of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, which follows. After all, they are matters that the Government will consider carefully. [Interruption.] Obviously the microphone is paying close attention to this exchange. That is why the Government have changed the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food into a Ministry for rural affairs and the environment. We shall take that wider perspective as we address the crisis in the rural economy.

Reproduced with the permission of the Controller of HMSO